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Announcer (00:00:00): It's time to think about the Bible like you never have before. This is Christian Questions. This podcast centers on godly principles, family values, and honest dialogue in a politically free zone. After the podcast, check out our other episodes, all our Bible study resources, videos. Download the CQ app and more at ChristianQuestions.com. Today's topic is, "Is It a Sin If I...? (Part II)". Coming up in this episode, sex and sexuality are a really big deal. Everywhere you look, there's overwhelming evidence of sexual liberation and freedom. We need to pause and consider how much of this is sinful or acceptable in God's eyes. Could we be crossing lines that Christians shouldn't be crossing? Now here's Rick and Julie.

Rick (00:00:49): Welcome everyone. I'm Rick. I'm joined by Julie, our CQ contributor for several years now. Julie, what is our theme scripture for today's episode?

Julie (00:00:57): Colossians 3:17: Whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks through him to God the Father.

Rick (00:01:08): As long as no one gets hurt, I can pretty much do whatever I want. Such as the battle cry of our present age. We are so advanced in our awareness and thinking, it has become easy to throw off the once constricting values of ages gone by and just be in the here and now. In our last, "Is It a Sin If I...?" episode, we looked at things like how we dress and adorn ourselves, cross-dressing and gambling. Today we look at some deep issues regarding the expression of our human sexuality. When it comes to sex, there are many hard questions that require diligent answers. Our diligence will be firmly centered around applying biblical teaching to our very advanced world today. So hold on. The clear scriptural answers that we will uncover are destined to trigger major tensions with those around us. So in Part I, Episode 1240, we discussed several important foundational points about sin and established that we were directing the biblical principles and our comments to those striving to be footstep followers of Jesus.

Julie (00:02:14): Today we're going to continue with specific questions our listeners have messaged us through the Christian Questions app or emailed us at inspirationchristianquestions.com. So here's our first question. Is it a sin if I have sex before marriage?

Rick (00:02:30): Okay, again, we're first of all,<laugh> we are addressing a Christian audience here. That's a very pointed question that has a very pointed answer.

Julie (00:02:39): There's several reasons why someone wanting to be a dedicated Christian may not wait for marriage. Now, they might say, I'm not convinced it's a sin. There is a complete normalization of any kind of sex in the media. And last week we talked about how some contemporary issues we face might be gray areas the Bible doesn't specifically address. But you don't think this one's a gray area at all, do you Rick?

New Speaker (00:03:03): No, absolutely no gray area. And we'll get into the idea of how it comes up and what we should do about it in just a minute.

Julie (00:03:12): Okay, so someone might say, I don't believe it's that bad of a sin. I love Jesus, but I also have sexual desires. That doesn't make me evil. After all, much of the time, it involves love or at least something similar. So how can love - or at least a lot of like - be that bad?

Rick (00:03:30): Yeah, it really comes down to the principles of following God through Christ. And that is the dividing line here. It's not how I feel. It's about what is right before God.

Julie (00:03:41): Another reason why someone may opt to do this is, they'd say, I believe it's a sin, but God will forgive me as long as I try hard not to do it again. And those kind of prayers might sound something like, God, please help me to stop doing this...but just not today!

Rick (00:03:56): <Laugh> And that's the problem - "but just not today." We are engaging in willfulness when we do that, and that's a whole different story.

Julie (00:04:04): And the last reason that I think is the majority, sometimes I just want what I want and it takes too much energy to fight it. We have tunnel vision in the moment when we know it's wrong, but we just do it anyway.

Rick (00:04:16): And there's a psychological term for what you just described. It's called cognitive dissonance. So let's define that.

Julie (00:04:23): According to PsychologyToday.com, the theory of cognitive dissonance proposes that people are averse to inconsistencies within their own minds. It offers one explanation for why people sometimes make an effort to adjust their thinking when their own thoughts, words, or behaviors seem to clash with each other. Now, this cognitive dissonance may help us to justify or look for loopholes or compartmentalize our thoughts in order to eliminate that uncomfortable mental conflict and guilt we have for doing what we know to be wrong.

Rick (00:04:55): So let's remember that as we move through. Now, we're going to lay out biblical principles all the way through this particular podcast so we can understand what we're leaning on. Our first biblical principle is, the power and position of marriage was stated in Genesis at creation and was clearly verified by Jesus as the sole standard for human relationships and sexuality in God's eyes. The sole standard. Let's look at Matthew 19:4-6, and then we'll go to verse 9:

Julie (00:05:26): "And he answered and said, Have you not read, that He who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother, and be joined to his wife; and the two shall become one flesh? So, they no longer are two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate."

Rick (00:05:45): So you have one man and one woman becoming one flesh. They're created as sexual beings. And this is, Julie, this is a very straightforward picture of that union, of that man and that woman. Let's go back to verse 9.

Julie (00:06:01): "And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery."

Rick (00:06:08): So we've got Jesus introducing the idea of immorality here, and we're going to expand on that in a moment. We're not here to talk about divorce today, but we're talking about immorality. We're talking about things that are outside of what God created to be and what Jesus said we should follow. So anything outside of that we will see is qualified under this word immorality. We'll expand that as we go.

Julie (00:06:31): I'm not plainly seeing "thou shalt not have premarital sex" in here quite yet. So are there loopholes in this biblical description?

Rick (00:06:40): Everybody wants loopholes. Well, here's the thing, yes, <laugh> there are five words that describe immorality or fornication in the New Testament. As we will see, they are all related and they're going to tell a complete story. So, Julie, walk us through these words.

Julie (00:06:55): Each of these five Greek words all have the word "porn" in them, related to our English word pornography. So right off the bat, that's not going to be good. And to our listeners, please don't miss getting the extensive CQ rewind Show Notes every week from ChristianQuestions.com or the Christian Questions app so that you can see all of these for yourself. Looking at the Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, the first word that meansimmorality or fornication, "pornos," means a male prostitute, but it's not just someone who does this as a profession, because the word also has the thought of someone capable of being bought or obtained for money or other valuable consideration. Or it could mean a person given to excessive indulgence in sensual pleasures.

Rick (00:07:38): So this is a broad-based masculine word that talks about sexuality being overly expressed in inappropriate ways.

Julie (00:07:49): The second Greek word that we translate is a noun, "porne," meaning a strumpet. Now that's an old-fashioned word for a woman who has many casual sexual encounters or relationships. And make note, that word figuratively means an idolator. The verb form of that word "porneuo" is meaning to act the harlot. So either sex indulging in unlawful lust, that's male or female, or it can mean to practice idolatry.

Rick (00:08:16): All right, so we've got these words that give you more a female sense of some of the male things, but they're all along the same lines of overindulgence.

Julie (00:08:26): Fourth word is "porneia," a noun meaning harlotry, including adultery and incest and figuratively once again idolatry. So in other words, sexuality outside of its appropriate place is engaging in idolatry because it worships the created and not the Creator.

Rick (00:08:41): And the idea of harlotry, again, is not about money being exchanged, it's about giving yourself over to something other than where it should be. That's an important aspect of this. What about the last word?

Julie (00:08:53): Yeah, the last one is "ekporneuo," and it means to be utterly unchaste. It's only used once in Jude 1:7, to describe the atrocities that happened in Sodom and Gomorra when it says they gave themselves over to fornication.

Rick (00:09:06): Okay, so we've got these five words and here's what it comes down to. It's all the same in God's eyes. All of these define sex outside of marriage, as we'll see, we're going to apply them in a moment, but they all also come down to this concept of being idolatrous and that's walking away from God. So this is not just doing something that maybe you're not supposed to do, this is doing something that's walking you away from God. Keep that in mind as we go through this. So now let's put these to work in a scripture to understand these words and thereby understand a clear answer to the sex before marriage question, because we haven't clearly answered that yet. We need to see these words in action. 1 Corinthians 6:9-19 uses all four of these words, the first four, Julie, that you talked about, and clarifies their meanings. So we're going to sum up some of these verses. Let's start with 1 Corinthians 6:9-11.

Julie (00:09:57): And this is in the American Standard version. "Or Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived; neither fornicators nor idolators..." And it goes on to list those who will not inherit the kingdom of God. But let's pause here. That word "fornicators" is that first and most basic Greek word "pornos" we talked about; a person given to excessive indulgence in sensual pleasures. And here it is - right next to idolatry.

Rick (00:10:23): <Laugh> Yeah, yeah. And there's no accident. And it's interesting that the ones that don't inherit the kingdom, the first word on the list is this word for fornicator. So the apostle is drawing strong attention to this misuse of our humanity.

Julie (00:10:39): So let's pick up with verse 11: "And such were some of you, but ye were washed and ye were sanctified, but ye were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the spirit of our God."

Rick (00:10:50): So Paul, in 1 Corinthians 6, began by using that basic word "fornicators" that you talked about, that masculine form of the word. And now he's going to expand to the other three forms of the word which define forbidden sexuality and behavior for Christians in a wide sense. And again, folks, remember we're talking to a Christian audience here with these descriptions. So now we're moving on to 1 Corinthians 6: part of verses 13, 15 and 16, and then 18-19.

Julie (00:11:21): "The Body is not for immorality (and that's that word for harlotry and idolatry), but it's for the Lord. Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ? Shall I then take away the members of Christ and make them members of a prostitute (and that's that woman who has many casual sexual encounters or relationships)? May it never be! Or do you not know that the one who joins himself to a prostitute (that same woman) is one body with her? For He said, The two shall become one flesh. Flee immorality (that harlotry and idolatry word). Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man (meaning indulging in unlawful lust) sins against his own body. Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the holy spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own?"

Rick (00:12:12): So in these verses, if you go back and you read them slowly in your own time, and I would encourage you to do that, you see this dramatic description about - this is big and important - and he says "every other sin that a man commits is outside of his body," but you by doing this, are sinning against your own body. And your body is the temple of God's spirit. What are you doing? So we need to understand, the apostle is saying immorality is an obvious major contradiction to all things godly, and all immorality is here included in these 1 Corinthians scriptures. All immorality brings us to idolatry. There's just no way to get away from that.

Julie (00:12:54): And it surprised me how much idolatry is intertwined with sexual immorality, because if we're serious about our commitment to God, we certainly don't want to break the most basic and important commandment.

Rick (00:13:04): And this is a great way to break it. So if you want <laugh> folks, don't try this at home. It really is what it boils down to. You want to break that adherence to godliness? This is a road that you go down. Now look, we may think that because our age now is an age of sexual acceptance and freedom, that the biblical guidelines are therefore obsolete. Not so. In Paul's time way back then, promiscuity was very common, especially among Gentiles. As a matter of fact, in the very next verse, and that's 1 Corinthians 7:1, the apostle Paul gives advice to counteract the promiscuity that he had witnessed. 1 Corinthians 7:1-2:

Julie (00:13:45): "Now concerning the things about which you wrote, it is good for a man not to touch a woman, but because of immoralities (that's harlotry, including adultery and incest), each man is to have his own wife and each woman is to have her own husband."

Rick (00:14:00): You notice that word is plural - "because of immoralities," because you people are loose. Why were they? Because they came from pure Paganism. This is what they were used to. They had to be trained into something else. They had to grow into the purity of the Christian call. And basically the apostle said, stop. Get married. Just stop. No more promiscuity because it is against God.

Julie (00:14:27): So there's our "Thou shalt not have sex before marriage." (There it is.) You're going to do this. Here's the solution.

Rick (00:14:32): Right. Absolutely. Okay, labeling sin and living above it, what do we have so far?

Julie (00:14:38): For Christians, it's simple, but not necessarily easy. Sex belongs only in marriage. And if we are truly followers of Jesus, we are bound to the simplicity and clarity of marriage being our only biblically sanctioned physical union. In the eyes of God.

Rick (00:14:55): Straightforward and clear. The question is, are we listening? So like it or not, the Apostle Paul zeroes in on clear-cut definitions for what is acceptable and what is not. So, what is MY response?

Julie (00:15:09): If sex is only supposed to be reserved for marriage, then why did some have several wives and concubines in the Old Testament?

Rick (00:15:16): All right, even though the Bible does not give a straightforward answer to this, we can be sure of several things. First and foremost, Jesus unequivocally uses the original standard of one wife and one husband as the absolute standard for his followers. Whatever God allowed in the Old Testament simply has no relevance to those who follow Christ. So whatever we look at, it is not relevant to our Christian lives. But Julie, let's examine it.

Julie (00:15:48): Our next big question is, why was polygamy allowed in the Bible? Why did God allow men to have more than one wife? And it sure didn't take long. Already by the fourth chapter of Genesis, Lamech married two women and then we have the examples of Jacob, David, Solomon, and others had multiple wives and even concubines.

Rick (00:16:05): Okay, that presents a problem. And just because God allowed it doesn't mean it was okay. And you got to take a breath and say, well wait, what are you saying? Let's expand this. God allowed divorce, for instance. He was no fan of divorce, and Jesus said it's because of the hardness of your hearts that He allowed it. So God does allow things that He does not endorse and that He's not pleased with. Why? Because sin needs to take its course. Here's our biblical principle as we look at this polygamy and so forth in the Old Testament. The biblical principle, when we are looking for loopholes, you mentioned that earlier in scriptural principle, we're really looking for personal convenience. As Christians, our lives are not to be built on convenience, but on compliance with God's highest principles.

Julie (00:16:55): We would love to find biblical technicalities to justify our questionable behavior. And it helps us tamp down that discomfort when we know deep down what we're doing is wrong. Like Aha! Solomon got to sleep with more than 700 women. Well, there you go!

Rick (00:17:11): What a problem. What a mess. Actually, we're going to touch on that in a little bit. In Episode 744, we addressed polygamy in the Bible. Many say that the Bible is "full" of this practice and it goes against the one man/one woman marriage concept, and therefore exceptions to that concept are acceptable. We believe God did not endorse polygamy, but He did tolerate it. Let's consider a few things. First of all, there are few examples of polygamy in the scriptures. Not many, many. There are few; most notably the kings of the Old Testament.

Julie (00:17:46): I've looked those up - in all those Old Testament examples, there was dysfunction and unhappiness.

Rick (00:17:52): And you can't say enough about that because it never ended well. That's really what we're saying. The next point is there are no Christian examples of polygamy. There is only one man and one woman. So we've got this very clear, if you are a Christian, you're saying, where do I belong in this? And the answer is, follow the Christian example. You have those things in the Old Testament. Let's go a little further. Moses, when he was prophesying to the people long before they crossed the Jordan River, what was going to happen, okay? And he said to them, there was going to come a time when they, as a nation, would want a king. Moses listed several guidelines for this coming change. He knew God told him and he told the people. And of all of these guidelines, he said, well, when you do get your king (you're not supposed to have one), but when you get your king here, and we're gonna only focus on one guideline, here is what you should make sure about this king. Deuteronomy 17:17:

Julie (00:18:52): "He shall not multiply wives for himself or else his heart will turn away, nor shall he greatly increase silver and gold for himself."

Rick (00:19:00): You see <laugh>, you have this prophecy long before it happened. And God said, no multiple wives. Just because you're king doesn't mean you're all that. That's really what God was saying <laugh>. God did not want Israel to have kings, but they demanded it anyway. We know that later on. God said that these kings should not have multiple wives, but the people, the kings, didn't listen. God therefore was not in favor of polygamy in the Old Testament, but He allowed it along with many other sinful things. He warns about wrong courses, but shows His willingness to let natural consequences of our actions take effect. So just because you think you can get away with it, buyer beware. It will catch up to you if you're following God through Christ.

Julie (00:19:48): And speaking of that link between sex and idolatry, the biggest evil to come out of Solomon having so many wives was that he started worshiping idols. I ran into, in my studies, this poignant quote from Bible commentary by Matthew Henry. And he said this, "There is not a more melancholy and astonishing instance of human depravity in the sacred Scriptures than Solomon becoming a public worshiper of abominable idols." That was just so sad and predictable and preventable.

Rick (00:20:19): When you look at that, and Julie, you were commenting earlier about the connection between the New Testament word for fornication, porn and how idolatry is always connected. There you have it. You can't get more graphic than the life of Solomon. He ended up worshiping idols because of all of the mess that he created. So no, these things were not sanctioned by God at all.

Julie (00:20:46): Let's move on to our next question. Is it a sin if I don't feel that I'm wired to be monogamous and therefore pursue other relationships? Monogamy is a broad term. There's different kinds of monogamy from mammals. For example, a quote from sciencefocused.com says, "We humans are termed socially monogamous by biologists, which means that we usually live as couples, but the relationships aren't permanent and some sex occurs outside the relationship." But for our purposes, Rick, we're going to refer to monogamy as one man and one woman keeping sexual relations within their marriage.

Rick (00:21:22): All right, so to start, we need to begin with a biblical principle, and then we can discuss the subject. So our biblical principle here in relation to monogamy: Christian thought and behavior are not built on fulfilling our most base human desires. On the contrary, our thoughts and behaviors are built upon reaching upward and becoming beings of love, of integrity and of discipline.

Julie (00:21:53): Let me give you the other side of that. I found another quote, Christopher Ryan, PhD and an author said this, "We rarely have only one sexual partner for our entire life. We have sex for reasons other than procreation. And the human desire to experiment is far too great to limit ourselves to one sexual partner in our lives."

Rick (00:22:14): Okay, timeout, <laugh>, timeout. When you say things like that, "we," and I know you're reading a quote, so I'm not blaming you, but "we" rarely do this and that this is why. It sounds like some major big, wonderful justification. It's nonsense because understand, understand Folks, there is something to be said, and these folks obviously don't understand it at all, for the idea of monogamy. And we're going to be getting into this, but here's what you're describing - you're describing somebody who's never satisfied. That's really what it comes down to. When somebody lives a life where they're never satisfied, that's what pornography does to you. It builds this never satisfied reaction into you. I feel pity for people who are stuck in that because they're missing so much of life. But we'll expand that. Go ahead. A little bit more on this reasoning:

Julie (00:23:04): Well, let's look at some of the reasons why men say they are not meant to be monogamous. One big thing isperhaps someone might say, love and sexual attraction for men are almost the same. So, because most men fall in love when they see attractive females, they always feel like wanting more than one woman.

Rick (00:23:24): Okay. So we as creatures of base, are we, you got to ask yourself the question, am I a creature of base instinct or a creature of discipline and choice? As a Christian, and we talked about this in our last episodeabout "Is It a Sin If I...?" As a Christian, I am supposed to follow the words and leadings of Jesus. It should be Jesus speaks, and I say, Yes, sir. Am I following that or am I going to say, well, you know what? My base instincts are going to bring me down THAT road. Which is it? You've got to make a choice. It comes down to idolatry. Here it is all over again. And to me, that statement is nonsense. I'll explain a little bit later. Let's go to another scripture, Matthew 19:5-6:

Julie (00:24:07): "For this reason, a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife. And the two shall become one flesh. So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate." Like you were saying, I appreciate that you talked about those choices. I mean, we have got choices when it comes to our sexual behavior, but part of the equation is how young children are growing up with the normalization of having multiple partners. And a huge problem with pornography is the way it trains the expectations of impressionable boys and girls. So we've got normalization, expectation and training. Now, another argument that men may have is they may say, well, men have always been polygamous throughout history. And in fact, some say it's only society and not biology that determines whether or not people are monogamous. It's advantageous for society as a whole, for example, to have a stable two-parent household. So this has been valued, at least in the past to have, to stay monogamous. But that's not really what they meant, want to do.

New Speaker (00:25:10): Well, and so what they're saying, well, polygamy existed throughout of all of human history, so therefore it's good. So is murder. Is therefore it good? <Laugh> I mean honestly, so has overly egotistical approaches to life. That doesn't make it good. If you look back at history, you know what you're also going to discover? Men were also monogamous. So if you want to make an argument, let's grow up and state the whole history and not just a piece to make yourself look good. This is, Julie, what this is doing is, it's taking principles and just watering them down so you can't recognize them anymore and creating an excuse because we have desires. That's not what a Christian does. 1 Timothy 3:1-2:

Julie (00:25:53): "It is a trustworthy statement; if any man aspires to the office of overseer, it is a fine work he desires to do. An overseer, then, must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, prudent, respectable, hospitable, able to teach."

New Speaker (00:26:07): So when they say throughout all of history, men have been polygamous. Well, I don't know about you, but that seems to say that in the Christian age, it's all about being the husband of one wife. So you've got 2,000 years ago, putting that in place and you also had Adam being told one man, one woman. Go ahead.

Julie (00:26:24): And that office of overseer, that is a leader within the Christian church, right?

Rick (00:26:28): Right. So you have what, that's setting standards, our standard, not the world standard. They can have whatever standard they want. That's something we've left behind. So we need to stand up for the Christlike standard. Yes, Sir, Lord Jesus, I follow where you lead.

Julie (00:26:46): I have one more point that some may make that the male libido drops when he's committed to one woman. Now there have been studies that show, married or not, men involved in committed relationships do have a lower testosterone level.

Rick (00:27:01): Okay. And I guess I don't understand the point of the, boy, this is supposed to be a big argument, right? Well, your testosterone drops, Ben, so don't let that happen.

Julie (00:27:09): Therefore, I have to have multiple women <laugh>, right? Right. That does sound stupid when you say it like that.

Rick (00:27:13): Well, but let's understand. Suppose that's true, and I don't know. Is it or not? Let's assume it is. What about, and I'm talking to Christian men - what about male, not testosterone, male devotion, male commitment, male caring, male cherishing of your wife, male developing that relationship that becomes the safest place in all of your life. The male response to the female love and affection. What about that? See, these folks don't understand that. They have no concept because they're stuck in sex, and they're not living life, and they end up always disappointed. Ephesians 5:28-29:

Julie (00:27:59): "So husbands ought also to love their own wives as their own bodies. He who loves his own wife loves himself; for no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes it and cherishes it, just as Christ also does the church."

Rick (00:28:12): A man should cherish his wife. That's what it comes down to. The monogamy that God created into Adam and Eve, and Jesus verified, is a powerful place for us to live and flourish in our Christian lives. So Julie, labeling sin and living above it, where are we?

Julie (00:28:32): This is a very serious question. When I look at myself in the mirror, do I see one who is striving for the sanctity of higher scriptural standards, or one who is sinking into a central cesspool of godless gratification? And if I'm sinking, I must seriously assess my condition and reach out for spiritual help, as my discipleship may well be at stake.

Rick (00:28:57): And make no mistake, if we are going down such roads, our discipleship is at stake. Jesus makes this plain. The Apostle Paul makes it plain. We need to understand what we're looking at here. This is all breathtakingly sobering. The worldly standards that surround us are the very poison that can and will make us spiritually sick.

Julie (00:29:24): So sex is supposed to be reserved for marriage, but what about things that are sexual but not actually sex?

Rick (00:29:31): Oh boy, once again, we're delving into the gray areas that our current day social norms have latched onto. As Christians, we need to be on our guard here. As we shall see, when it comes to asking questions about gray areas, the answers are usually black and white. Having technology in the palm of your hand is not permission to creatively sin. Let's understand that. Let's set the ground rules right here, right now.

Julie (00:30:05): Is it a sin if I engage in sexting? I'm not physically touching anyone, so what's the problem? And I know for sure, Rick, the Bible does not talk about sexting. <Laugh> Yeah. Sexting is sending sexual text messages often involving explicit photos or videos of yourself. This is a special issue for teens who are often under severe pressure to engage in this as a way of flirting or because of bullying or a dare or even proof of commitment of young relationships. The potential for damage with this digital footprint that's created is huge and has involved child pornography laws with felony prosecutions. It's a nightmare for our young people out there.

Rick (00:30:46): Yeah, it is. And we need to approach this carefully because you're right, it's a big problem. It's easy and it's encouraged. And when we have all of those things in one package, it spells trouble. So what do we do? Well, first let's look at a scripture and then we'll establish scriptural principle. Matthew 5:27-28:

Julie (00:31:08): And this is Jesus speaking. "You Have heard that it was said, you shall not commit adultery. But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart."

Rick (00:31:20): All right, so again, it talks about men and committing adultery and all of that, and you're talking about kids and sexting. So obviously you've got a principle here, and the principle is the desire and the acting and the indulging in the desire. So we're not going be talking about the married men necessarily, although that has a lot to do with it. But let's expand it to a broader base as we look at to try to understand where do we stand on things like this. Here's our biblical principle: Godliness and sanctified living are not made up of buffet table choices. If we truly follow Jesus, then our every decision is driven by the highest principles that we can possibly reach, the highest principles we as individuals can possibly reach. So wherever you are, reach a little higher, just keep reaching a little higher. And we need to decide that we're going to rise above the difficulties, the temptations, the challenges, the trials of things like this. So we need several scriptures to lay some groundwork. So the principles of this next scripture show us the importance of full compliance with God's word and God's way. And again, we're talking about a principle in this next scripture and applying it directly to that question, Julie, about sexting. So 1 Timothy 4:1-2:

Julie (00:32:42): "Now the spirit speaketh expressly that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils, speaking lies and hypocrisy, having their conscience seared with a hot iron."

Rick (00:32:55): "Having their conscience seared with a hot iron, speaking lies and hypocrisy." So you've got this, and this is talking about spiritual leadership, and we want to take the principle of this and apply it down to the rest of us. Maybe not those who are in spiritual leadership, although it does apply to them too. The question you have to ask yourself, if you're involved in things like sexting, you say, well, look, I'm not doing anything bad. I'm not touching anybody. Can't I do this? Is my conscience seared? If you have a seared conscience, that means it's numb, it doesn't feel, it doesn't respond the way it's built to respond. Am I just looking for ways to feed my desires rather than looking for ways to crucify my flesh? You see, both of those things are about our flesh. We're either feeding it or we're crucifying it. If you're a Christian, which is the right choice? It's to crucify the flesh. Yes, Sir, Lord Jesus, I follow in your footsteps. The Apostle Paul next tells us that our very sanctification depends on our sensual purity. Now this is a big statement. Our sanctification, our being set apart for a holy purpose, depends on sensual purity. Listen to this scripture carefully. 1Thessalonians 4, Julie, let's do verses 3-5 and then 7-8:

Julie (00:34:14): "For this is the will of God, your sanctification; that is that you abstain from sexual immorality (and that was one of our porn definitions we talked about); that each of you know how to possess his own vessel in sanctification and honor, not in lustful passion like the Gentiles who do not know God. For God has not called us for the purpose of impurity, but in sanctification. So he who rejects this is not rejecting man but the God who gives His holy spirit to you."

Rick (00:34:42): So you have a powerful, powerful teaching from the Apostle Paul; abstain from sexual immorality. That's one of those porn words again, just showing up here. And it says, "possessing his own vessel," his own body "in sanctification." Possess your body as a Christian in honor, not in lustful desires like everybody else. They don't know God. You do, you have a different set of standards. We have to rise up to it. For God has not called us for the purpose of impurity, but again, to be set apart. So what this comes down to once again is idolatry. If you are involving yourself in sexting, for instance, you can make all the excuses you want. I'm not touching anybody, I'm not doing this. But you are engaging in idolatry. You have another god. You have become an idolator because you have put something before godly principle, and it's a big something. So please, please understand the seriousness of this. And if this is something that's overtaking you, get someone to help you. Be honest, be vulnerable, find that spiritual mentor or leader that could help you back away from these things.

Julie (00:35:58): Let's move on to another question. Is it a sin if I have a baby out of wedlock? And there's two parts to this issue. First, is it a sin for the father and mother? What if they get married before the baby comes or after the baby comes or they never get married? Does that change your answer? And second, is the baby doomed because of the parents' actions?

Rick (00:36:20): Okay, really, really good questions. And I think unfortunately there is a lot of this in the world in which we live and we look at our Christianity and we look at the things that happen like, oh, I'm pregnant, now what, what have I done? Does God hate me? What happens to my child? You have all of these things, and it's very emotional. So let's set a biblical principle, and then let's take it apart piece by piece and apply these principles to fashion a hopefully very clear answer. First biblical principle here that we want to put in play: As Christians, we're blessed to have forgiveness for our sins through Jesus. However, it's not as simple just, okay, I have forgiveness. Our forgiveness is not a free pass to sin and then be forgiven. Our forgiveness must be confirmed by our repentant thoughts, words and deeds.

Julie (00:37:17): In Part I, we had ended on the question, is it okay to sin if we're saved by grace? So what about grace in all this?

Rick (00:37:26): It's not okay to sin if you're saved by grace. It's simply not okay. That's not a good question to ask. Is it okay to say okay to sin because I'm saved by grace? No. As a matter of fact, the Apostle Paul in Romans 6:1 said we've died to sin, so we can't continue to live in it. So you've put that behind you. The more appropriate question is, I tried and I failed. Now I need grace to help me stand and never go back there again. How do I do that? That's really where we want to get to here.

Julie (00:37:57): Right. So let's answer the question then. First, is it a sin for the parents? What if they get married before the baby comes or after the baby comes or they never get married, which is the sin?

Rick (00:38:08): Okay. The sin was having sex outside of marriage. The pregnancy is a natural consequence of that sin. So now you've got this natural consequence. The sin is not being pregnant or being born to unmarried parents for the Christian mother and the Christian father of this child conceived in sin. If it's a Christian, one or both is Christian, the principles will apply to that Christian individual. There are three things we want to talk about very clearly. And the first thing is, you find yourself in this situation, you pray. And when I say pray, I mean you bluntly bring your sin before God. Don't sugarcoat it. Don't make it like, well, it was kind of like... It was a bad thing to do. And however you got into it, whether there was coercion or not, is not material at this moment. What's material is, Lord, I sinned. I sinned, and we need to ask for forgiveness. Hebrews 4:16:

Julie (00:39:08): "Therefore let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need."

Rick (00:39:17): Okay, "mercy and grace to help in time of need." This is important. You don't find it unless you ask for it. God's not just going to interrupt your life and tap you on the shoulder and say, I know you need ME, so here I am. He's going to wait because that's the way it works. So we pray. The next thing we ought to do-- and all of these things, Folks, are not necessarily in order - we need to repent. But we need to repent outwardly. We need to change our direction. This is what the Apostle Peter told Simon the magician to do when Simon wanted the power to give people the holy spirit. So let's look at Acts 8:22:

Julie (00:39:53): "Therefore repent of this wickedness of yours, and pray the Lord that if possible, the intention of your heart may be forgiven you."

Rick (00:40:00): The idea - the meaning - of repentance is changing your direction. That repentance needs to be outward. It needs to have a sense of, here I am, this is what I did, and here is what I'm doing to make good for, to recompense the things that I did. I am willing to accept and be accountable and move forward outwardly and change your direction. And this third piece is to be accountable. Outward repentance demands accountability, and this is appropriate. And if we've committed a sin like this, we need to seek accountability. Bring spiritually strong, trusted leaders or mentors into your experience and then live that repentance. Let's go to James 5:16:

Julie (00:40:49): "Therefore, confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another, so that you may be healed. The effective prayer of a righteous man can accomplish much." And obviously with any sin, the goal is to repent voluntarily and not just because you got caught.

Rick (00:41:04): You know, and <laugh> that's a huge thing, to repent voluntarily. You get caught. And look, if you're pregnant, you eventually show, okay. Eventually it's revealed. We need to take it upon ourselves as early as we are strong enough to muster, and bring the accountability on, knowing that God can forgive us if we are truly sincere and willing to change our direction.

Julie (00:41:31): Now under the second point about that baby being somehow doomed; in Old Testament Israel, there were restrictions for those of what the New American Standard calls "illegitimate birth." The big scripture people point to is Deuteronomy 23:2 "No one of illegitimate birth shall enter the assembly of the Lord; none of his descendants, even to the tenth generation, shall enter the assembly of the Lord." This was serious.

Rick (00:41:55): Yeah. And it sounds like a very big proclamation, like you're thrown out of society, is what it sounds.

Julie (00:42:01): For 10 generations!

Rick (00:42:02): Yeah. Yeah, it sounds like it, this is too big. But that's not what the scripture actually means. So Julie, let's get some definition on this.

Julie (00:42:10): So the Bible commentary by John Wesley said that "shall not enter into the congregation of the Lord" means "shall not be admitted to honors and offices, either in the church or Commonwealth of Israel. And so the congregation of the Lord does not here signify the body of the people, but the society of the elders or rulers of the people." So in other words, this referred to civil leadership in Israel, and that term "illegitimate birth," while it might mean out of wedlock, it could also refer to those born of mixed marriages between the people of Israel and their Pagan nations or a baby born from incest.

Rick (00:42:48): So, in any case, it was being out of the limelight of leadership in civil Israel, and that was appropriate because it was a physical nation with physical laws on a physical land. God made it so that their physical government would be an adherence to Him exactly. But it wasn't throwing them out of Israel. And that's the key. So we've got that as the Old Testament principle. The New Testament true Christian environment principle actually goes even beyond that. The repentant parent or parents and the innocent child that came from their sin are truly welcome. And you notice when I say they're welcome, it's preceded by repentance, making sure that you understand sin is sin and you're willing to accept it be accountable for it. 1 Corinthians 6:11:

Julie (00:43:40): "Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, and in the spirit of our God."

Rick (00:43:49): "Such were some of you." We sometimes fall, and the beauty is we can get up, we can ask for forgiveness, change our direction, and we can walk back into favor. But we need to mean it, and it needs to come from the heart. God sees our heart, you can't fool Him. So even when it comes to serving the brotherhood, so that was a scripture that 1 Corinthians 6:11 gives us a sense that anybody can come back in and be welcome as they are repentant. But when it comes to serving the brotherhood, you talked about in Israel the civil authority serving the brethren with spiritual authority. There are no disqualifying statements to exclude a child born out of such an experience. Let's look at these qualifications for an overseer, one who is an elder in the Christian church, a minister. 1 Timothy 3. Julie, let's do verses 2-4, then 6-7:

Julie (00:44:42): "An overseer, then, must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, prudent, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, not addicted to wine or pugnacious, but gentle, peaceable, free from the love of money. He must be one who manages his own household well and not a new convert. And he must have a good reputation with those outside the church." That's a lot of qualifications, but I noticed one qualification isn't "you can't be born out of wedlock."

Rick (00:45:08): <Laugh> Right. So, right. So that's not something that's held over you, for instance, from a Christian perspective. So, see, there's good news, folks, and the good news comes from acknowledging sin, repenting of sin and being accountable in an appropriate way. That's what's required of us as Christians. We do make mistakes; let's stand up, take responsibility and move forward.

Julie (00:45:33): But I think that the question people are asking is, will that baby automatically go to hell because of the sin of the parents?

Rick (00:45:39): And the answer is absolutely, unequivocally no because the Bible does not teach of a burning hell. It simply doesn't. We have got many, many, many, many podcasts on that subject. So no, you don't have to worry about that.

Julie (00:45:54): I would say for anyone who is concerned about that and would like to find out more, go to Christian Questions.com and just search "hell" and see our other podcasts on that subject.

Rick (00:46:02): Okay, labeling sin and living above it. What do we have?

Julie (00:46:06): If we proclaim to be Christians, then we are proclaiming to be different. We are proclaiming to live far above how we feel, and that can easily make us look pathetic, and frankly out of touch, to our worldly peers as they indulge where we will not. We proclaim to be accountable for our wrongdoing, and instead of hiding, we outwardly repent, which opens the door to living forgiven.

Rick (00:46:32): Outwardly repent opens the door to living forgiven. So much of human sexuality is built around how we feel in any given moment. What a contrast to living for Jesus in every given moment!

Julie (00:46:48): With all this firm guidance in hand, are there any gray areas when it comes to any and all living together situations?

Rick (00:46:56): Well, the abrupt answer would be no, but this answer demands explanation. Because the world is complicated, we need to find and apply the needed scriptural principles to whatever unique circumstance we may come across. The good news is there is always a scriptural principle that will give us guidance in every single situation we may encounter.

Julie (00:47:25): Rick, is it a sin if I live with a romantic partner before marriage? And what if we are planning on getting married and what if we are not, absolutely not, having sexual relations?

Rick (00:47:38): Good questions. Good questions. (Thank You.) Yeah. Let me start by saying here, here's an old and slightly misquoted saying. We changed one of the words in the saying to fit a scripturally sound definition. But the quote is, "The road to destruction is paved with good intentions." And what we mean by that is, we can say that I can have all kinds of reasons for doing something that ends up being marginal and therefore wrong. Why do we consider it marginal and therefore wrong? Let's set the biblical principle, and then let's put the pieces in order. The biblical principle: As Christians, we're not only responsible for our own thoughts and behavior, we are also tasked with working at upbuilding the thoughts and behaviors of our fellow Christians as they observe our life experiences.

Julie (00:48:31): It's eye-opening to see that it's not just about ME; it's about MY effect on YOU.

Rick (00:48:38): Very much so, and Julie, frankly, this is a point that in these kinds of questions we tend to forget when we want to settle our lives in the way that we'd like to live them, we forget the effect that we have scripturally on those around us, on the brotherhood. We do have an effect, like it or not. So living together, even if in the best case you stay far away from each other, what does that do? It gives the appearance of immorality, even if innocent and unintentional. We're obligated to respect the consciences of one another, of those outside, of those who may be looking in. Once again, we have a scriptural principle in Romans 14:13-15.

Julie (00:49:23): And this is in the context of food, that nothing is unclean to eat, but whoever thinks it is, then they should follow their conscience and not eat it. So here's some excerpts. "We Are not to put an obstacle or stumbling block in a brother's way, for if because of food your brother is hurt, you are no longer walking according to love. Do not destroy with your food him for whom Christ died." And I'm going add 1 Corinthians 8:9: "But take care lest this freedom of yours does not somehow become a stumbling block to the weak." All right, I don't mean to be so blunt, but at what point is it nobody's business? You can't please everyone or be completely inoffensive even within the brotherhood. Somebody somewhere is going to disagree with you about what you're doing or how you're doing it, even if you're doing the right thing.

Rick (00:50:09): Okay. So let's understand if you are doing the absolute highest right thing possible, you will fulfill the scripture that we just read about not putting a stumbling block in somebody else's way. You're not creating a situation that could be a trap for somebody to fall into. Oh, you mean the two of you live together, huh? Isn't that interesting? They find out because you have the same address.

Julie (00:50:34): But aren't they just gossiping and being, you know, chatty. And that's wrong.

Rick (00:50:39): Nobody's talking about people talking about it. What we're talking about is it's not talk, we're not addressing being chatty, we're talking about the impression that I am leaving for you as you look at me and say, that's an unusual situation. Usually when people live together, there is A, B and C and you start to scratch your head and then you've planted a seed. My actions have planted a seed. You don't have to say it to anybody. It doesn't have to be any gossip. You can just be thinking, that's odd. And you know what? Thoughts like that don't just go away. They sit there and they fester. Here's the thing; the Apostle Paul concludes this teaching in Romans 14 with a subtle but powerful statement. Romans 14:21-22. There's a powerful principle at the end of the scripture.

Julie (00:51:26): "It Is good not to eat meat or drink wine, or do anything by which your brother stumbles. The faith which you have, have as your own conviction before God. Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves."

Rick (00:51:39): That last sentence, "happy is he," and I'm going to paraphrase it a little bit. Happy is the individual who does not condemn himself in what he himself approves as his own actions. So in other words, the apostle is saying, you are happy if what your self-approval is showing is absolute, pure, unadulterated, godly behavior that stands above reproach. That's the whole point of Romans 14. Don't do something that could cause your brother to stumble. So for the sake of others, we need to look at ourselves and say, no, that's not a good idea. It's too easily misinterpreted. I don't want go down that road. Let's go further. We don't want to encourage others to sin. 1 Corinthians 8:12:

Julie (00:52:27): "And so, by sinning against the brethren and wounding their conscience when it is weak, you sin against Christ."

Rick (00:52:34): What happens here is, you've got this situation where you're sinning against Christ when you might sin against someone whose conscience is weak. So Julie, in my example before, if your conscience is weak ,and I plant that seed in your head, I'm at fault for doing that. I shouldn't have done that. It comes down to setting boundaries. It comes down to making sure that we set the right boundaries. You've got a small child, and one of the things you teach your small child is, don't play in the street. Now, I would say to you as a Christian, you're not going to tell your child don't play in the street. What you're going to tell them is, don't play even near the street. In other words, your boundary is not the white line of the street from the breakdown lane into the travel lane. You can go up to that white line, but don't step over it. That's not the way you counsel your child. You say to them, you see this tree which is 25 feet away from that white line? You don't go past this tree because you're too close to the streets. That's the point of this, making sure we're not even close to the street so nobody gets hurt. On top of this, another major consideration here is protecting the purity and reputation of that romantic partner that you're involved with, or you say you're not involved with, but you're protecting. You need to protect their purity and their reputation. Philippians 2:3-4:

Julie (00:53:55): "Do nothing from selfishness or empty conceit, but with humility of mind regarding one another as more important than yourselves; do not merely look out for your own personal interests, but also the interests of others."

Rick (00:54:07): We want to look at this scripture and say, let me apply it to that person that I am in love with, but I'm trying to, we're trying to cohabitate but not really cohabitate, but only look like we're cohabitating because we want to save money, whatever your reasons are. As humans, we need to face the fact that any cohabitation outside of marriage can easily put us in a compromised position regarding our attraction to one another and can put my significant other in a position of being looked upon badly. Do I want to do that?

Julie (00:54:38): This is an important perspective, because if we're going to engage in such a sin that clearly involves another person, and I'm talking really more about that premarital sex we talked about earlier, we have to understand the responsibility of our actions in causing someone else's relationship with God to break down. Some people can't come back from that kind of anguish. So do we want to participate in this? Am I actually going to encourage someone else to commit idolatry against God for my temporary pleasure, or in this case because I want to live with that person and play house?

Rick (00:55:12): You know, we can be a catalyst in other people's lives. What am I a catalyst for? Am I a catalyst towards idolatry or a catalyst towards spirituality? Choose. We make our choices by looking at the subtlety of our lives. Here's the bottom line on all of this. Marriage is where sexual expression is pure before God. Hebrews 13:4:

Julie (00:55:35): "Marriage is to be held in honor among all, and the marriage bed is to be undefiled; for fornicators (and that's one of those words) and adulterers God will judge."

Rick (00:55:44): You understand that in this verse it talks about "marriage is honorable," "the marriage bed is undefiled." It's clean, it's surrounded by goodness. There's no shame. This, Folks, to be blunt, this is where sex in all of its wonder, in all of its expression, in all of its exploration belongs. "The Marriage bed is undefiled." It's pretty clear we need to be morally firm in our stand regarding all aspects of sexuality. Ephesians 5:3-5:

Julie (00:56:21): "But immorality (and that's one of those words) or any impurity or greed must not even be named among you, as is proper among saints; and there shall be no filthiness and silly talk, or coarse jesting, which is not fitting, but rather giving of thanks. For this you know with certainty, that no immoral or impure person or covetous person, who is an idolator, has an inheritance in the kingdom of God and Christ." Again, Rick immorality and idolatry are linked in the same sentence. That's something to really think about.

Rick (00:56:52): It's one of the most powerful points that we can possibly make here. Any immoral actions, and I will add immoral thoughts, lead us down a road of idolatry. And if you remember the very first commandment is, "Thou shalt have no other gods before Me." God put that in place for a reason. And sexuality is such a powerful draw in our lives. It can, in its proper place, it can draw us closer to God through its proper expression. But in so many circumstances, through all of the variations and things that we've talked about, it can be a tool of Satan to draw us toward him, Satan, not toward God. We are drawn into idolatry, worshiping the created rather than the Creator. So Julie, as we begin to close all of this up, this has really been quite a discussion. This is not our normal Christian Questions-type topic, Folks. <Laugh> Humility before God and each other is always an appropriate basis for any and all relationships we have. Humility and faith in God's care prepare us to stand against Satan. 1 Peter 5:6-9:

Julie (00:58:06): "Therefore, humble yourselves under the mighty hand of God, that He may exalt you at the proper time, casting all your anxiety on Him, because He cares for you. Be of sober spirit, be on the alert. Your adversary, the devil, prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour. But resist him, firm in your faith, knowing that the same experiences of suffering are being accomplished by your brethren who are in the world." Rick, you and Jonathan are happily and faithfully married. I'm happily and faithfully married. So some would say, well, sure, it's easy for you. You don't have to deal with this. What's your response?

Rick (00:58:44): Well, first of all, nothing is ever easy. To be happily and faithfully married is a result of a lot of work and a lot of humility and making mistakes and repenting and turning and so forth and so on. But my other response is, okay, if you're in this situation, today is the ideal time to stop, to consider and to turn around. That's the point. That's what we want to understand here. It takes humility to do that. But if you are a footstep follower of Jesus, that's what you're required to do. You need to start somewhere, and however hard it's been, Folks, wherever you are, you can stop right here, right now and turn the page. Turn the corner, walk a different direction. Labeling sin and living above it. Julie, let's wrap this up.

Julie (00:59:32): When it comes to all aspects of human sexuality, our responsibility as Christians is clear. We are to live above the fray. We are to uphold standards that will be laughed at, insulted, and be categorized as bigoted and unfair and outdated. Our lot is to stand to the best of our ability, as Jesus stood against the tide of sin and corruption, and in doing so, we honor God with our sexuality.

Rick (00:59:59): See, sexuality is not sinful inherently. The way we use it, we can choose to make it sinful or something that is actually honoring to God. Make the choice as to which direction that you yourself will go. Folks, this is hard. This is not easy, especially in the world in which we live. You need to decide to stand above and beyond. Put your faith in those who see godly principles and not your faith in those who just see the moment, because they not only are wrong, but they'll end up broken. That's what always happens. Think about it. Folks, we love hearing from our listeners. We welcome your feedback and questions on this episode and other episodes at ChristianQuestions.com. Coming up in our next episode: "Is the Lord Really My Shepherd?" Talk to you next week.

Final Notes (01:00:51): Copyright @2023 Christian Questions. In addition to this transcript, we provide comprehensive CQ Rewind Show Notes for every episode. They include every scripture quoted during the podcast, as well as graphics, illustrations and bonus material. Click the "CQ Rewind Show Notes" button near the audio player or sign up to receive these weekly at ChristianQuestions.com. This transcript was created using artificial intelligence. While we believe it to be accurate, we apologize for any errors that may exist.